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 Referendum: In or Out 
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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:18 pm 
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I'm not one for saying, "I told you so," but you can see from this news story that "the End of the World is nigh financially" was blatant lies from Osbourne and his cronies. I'm sure the rest of their lies will soon be shown up for what they are and all these idle threats from these brave :lol: European leaders (who are too damn scared to ask their own people's opinion) will soon wilt and grateful handshakes will be exchanged when all the deals that once were are current deals again. (actually, they still are because nothing's changed yet.)

FTSE 100 closes above pre-Brexit level http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36660133

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 8:45 am 
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Hi Dave

It's a bit early to be thinking that everything will be fine. Once this decision really sinks in and all of the implications have been analysed the markets could go either way. Over the next year or so things will become apparent that haven't yet been fully thought through and which could have an impact on all of us. While both campaigns promised the extremes of either outcome, the truth will likely be somewhere in the middle with gains and losses on both sides. Don't forget that the UK has a huge debt running into trillions of pounds with millions of pounds of interest being paid out daily so any downturn in the economy can have a much greater impact than you might think as those debts will still need to be serviced whatever the economy is doing.

While it is easy to take a swipe at the European Leaders we need to remember that these are the people who will decide the UK's short term future. They can smooth negotiations through or they can make it extremely difficult for us, so gloating at them and insulting them as Farrage has done is not the way to go at this stage. There is little advantage to the EU in making things easy for us to leave as they are desperate to prevent any further break up so giving the UK an easy ride will do nothing for that aim. The break up of the EU wouldn't be particularly good for the UK at this stage either as the last thing we need while things settle down for us would be the rest of Europe being thrown into further turmoil.

It isn't my intention to be pessimistic about the outcome but the current euphoria about the result needs to be tempered a little as this will not be a smooth road. The UK is a resilient country and we'll get through whatever happens because we have to, but just because we are leaving the EU is not a guarantee that everything will be wonderful. Whether this has been a good or a bad decision is unlikely to be fully known in my lifetime.

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Brian


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:36 am 
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Hi Brian,

I hope I don't come across as euphoric in any way, shape or form as I certainly don't feel any form of euphoria at all. Yes, I'm delighted we chose to leave a very corrupt organisation behind but I'm under no illusions about it being a bed of roses from here on in. I do feel, however, that there has been - and still is - a certain amount of sabotage of the markets by some very sore losers. Many have realised that they were just cutting off their noses to spite their faces but some, I'm sure, are still being very negative.

As for the European leaders trying to give us a hard time, I think not. All these people care about is big business and money. They are slaves to these things.

This morning some of them are saying "Free movement" is on the table and if you don't agree to it then you won't get access to the single market. Imagine what BMW are going to say to Merkel then when we ban the import of their vehicles. Imagine what the French farmers will do when we ban the import of their produce. I'm sure there are countless other examples too. Those smarta*se leaders would have a civil war on their hands before they knew it.

We need someone on our side who is not going to roll over and play dead when these negotiations start. I don't trust anyone who's in the frame at the moment and that worries me. Most sensible people would look to maintain the status quo but there are always the ones looking to take advantage and we need to have a strong leader who'll not be frightened to say, "No chance, Mate" when the bully boys try and threaten us.

It is easy to take at swipe at European leaders, Brian, because they've failed at every level. They have never managed to sort out a crisis in their entire history. They just flounder from one to the next leaving a trail of chaos in their wake that someone else has to sort out. And the biggest crisis of them all (pre-Brexit [I hate that word]) is the Euro crisis. Their currency. They still haven't sorted it out and don't look capable of doing so. They've crippled every Mediterranean economy under their banner. Spain has unemployment levels of 40% in many regions and no prospect of an improvement. Is it any wonder then that these people want to head north to France, Germany and the UK?

I agree with you, though, when you say that this country is resilient. It is a wonderful characteristic that has done this country proud many, many times before. And I'm not worried one bit about the so-called huge national debt either. It is said that the 5 richest families in this country (who basically call all the shots behind the scenes) could pay off the entire debt tomorrow morning without even flinching so I hardly think we'll be left to go under at the hands of a bunch of eurocrats.

It is very much a case of jockeying for position at the moment in the world of politics. Some will look to make a name for themselves, some will genuinely seek to help. We need to find out who's who very quickly or pay the price. Given the right leadership, though, our future will be a much happier one under a truer democratic society than the Brussels Nazi Party.

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:59 am 
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It's looking likely that Michael Gove or Theresa May will be the new PM.

Mr Bean or Thatcher mk2

Marvellous :-/


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 10:11 am 
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God help us if Thatcher Mk II gets the job! What worries me is that it's the Tories themselves who get to decide and they loved Adolf Thatcher.

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 11:44 am 
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I've read reports that there will be a snap election later this year , though I'm sure whoever manages to take over the reigns will try and avoid one !

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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 12:03 pm 
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I don't think even the Tory membership will vote for a backstabber so that probably leave us with May, who is not what I'd call leader material but the Thatcher fans will probably love her.
And now the parliamentary labour party is in self destruct mode and unless everyone is reading it wrongly, going against the membership, not looking very good.


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 5:19 pm 
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Never in the field of political conflict have so many been so screwed by so few. :(

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 6:27 pm 
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i've spoken to quite a few friends who all landed themselves a job in different parts of the capitol to deal with all the paperwork involved in the brexit, and the one thing they have certified between them(bear in mind they have no common affiliate except through myself and all have never met each other) that there will be an ''open'' election towards the end of this year for all parties not just conservatives, whether or not its truesay is only a matter of time

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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:26 pm 
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clam1952 wrote:
I don't think even the Tory membership will vote for a backstabber so that probably leave us with May, who is not what I'd call leader material but the Thatcher fans will probably love her.
And now the parliamentary labour party is in self destruct mode and unless everyone is reading it wrongly, going against the membership, not looking very good.

Aren't there any other Tory supporters on here!? :lol:

Thatcher was before my time, though from what I know, I certainly wouldn't have been keen on her. Despite descriptions of May as Thatcher mk2 (I agree she is more authoritarian than the other candidates), I will probably be voting for her due to the fact I believe she has the skills and determination to carry out future EU negotiations.

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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2016 3:19 am 
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I dare say she'd be more thorough than Mr Bean and Boris, but judging by the amount of cock-ups and U-turns by this government, I wouldn't trust them to run a tap - let alone the country.

It'll be business as usual. Different face - same Tories. Tax cuts for the rich whilst the poor survive on food banks. The severely disabled being found fit for work. Plus further into national debt whilst still claiming that they are the party to fix it.

You can't polish a turd and all that.


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 5:08 pm 
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Guys guys,

lets all just be glad it's not Jeremy Corbyn who has a chance :lol:

Nathan

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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:16 pm 
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naf1234 wrote:
Guys guys,

lets all just be glad it's not Jeremy Corbyn who has a chance :lol:

Nathan

He'd be a darn sight better than ANY Tory!!

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:38 pm 
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cyberdonblue wrote:
naf1234 wrote:
Guys guys,

lets all just be glad it's not Jeremy Corbyn who has a chance :lol:

Nathan

He'd be a darn sight better than ANY Tory!!

Dave


I second that one Dave, I think some people don't like him because he's the first principled politician we've had in ages. Why do you think the Blairites dislike him.

Oh joy the prospect of another authoritarian 'no nonsense' tory, have we been here before I wonder :roll:.

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 Post subject: Re: Referendum: In or Out
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 5:14 pm 
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Jeremy Corbyn might not be the man to lead Labour - and he might have the charisma of a housebrick - BUT he's the only "genuine" leader of a party we've had in my lifetime (i'm 36).

He comes from a modest fairly normal background. He doesn't suffer fools. He doesn't agree with millionaires becoming richer whilst poor people suffer - in fact, he's very much in favour of the benefits system supporting those that need it and millionaires paying more. He's very in-touch with many of the working poor families.

That's why he's disliked by his own MPs - but liked by Labour party members and unions. He represents what Labour USED to stand for - the every day working family. Whereas his own MPs are Labour MPs - but Tory-lite MPs that wouldn't be out of place on the opposite benches.

Corbyn is Labour. Thanks to Tony Blair, most Labour MPs are lightweight Tories. The only other notable exception that is Labour through-and-through and on our wavelength is Dennis Skinner.

Labour want to continue down the Tory-lite route - and won't be content until Corbyn has gone and replaced with someone like Andy Burnham.


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